Friday, August 28, 2015

I Am Hillary (Rodham) Clinton's 18th Cousin, and perhaps Donald Trump's 19th Cousin Once Removed

A reader emailed me recently noting the article that Hillary (Rodham) Clinton is Donald Trump's 19th cousin - see Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton revealed to be distant cousins as family trees show they share same set of royal ancestors from the Daily Mail on 25 August 2015.  My reader then asked if I was related to both of them:

I went to which has a thriving project for famous persons.  I quickly found Hillary (Rodham) Clinton's profile (Rodham-1) and clicked on the "Relationship to Me" link (it's under the person's name next to "My WikiTree), and the relationship chart appeared (three screens shown):

So, Hillary is my 18th cousin.  Our common ancestor for this relationship is Pierre de Luxembourg (1390-1433).  

On the right side of the first screen above, there is a box that says "Explore more: 37 common ancestors were found between Hillary and Randy within 25 generations. To view the relationship trails, select the common ancestor here."  That dropdown list provides the names of all 37 of our common ancestors, according to WikiTree, back 25 generations or less.  

Before someone asks about Donald Trump, I tried my relationship to myself also.  He is Trump-66 on WikiTree.  WikiTree said that we were not related by blood back at least 25 generations.  

Interestingly, WikiTree doesn't find a relationship between Hillary (Rodham) Clinton and Donald Trump.  

The Daily Mail article provided a comparison of their lines of descent from John of Gaunt through two of his children, which was probably from the relationship calculator - see the blog post at Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton Are Related – And This is How.

I am related to John of Gaunt, according to WikiTree - he is my 19th great-grandfather through his daughter, Joan Beaufort.  So if Donald and Hillary are descended from John of Gaunt and are 19th cousins (meaning he is their 18th great-grandfather), according to Geni, then I must be a 19th cousin once removed to Donald Trump.  

But WikiTree doesn't show Donald Trump as a descendant of John of Gaunt.  It doesn't show that Hillary Clinton is a descendant of John of Gaunt, but is a 2nd cousin 19 times removed to him.  

Obviously, and have different Royal/Noble entries in their databases.  Who knows which one is more correct!

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Copyright (c) 2015, Randall J. Seaver

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52 Ancestors in 52 Weeks - Week 87: #103 Catharina (Ruth?) Konig (1770-1813)

Amy Johnson Crow suggested a weekly blog theme of "52 Ancestors" in her blog post Challenge:  52 Ancestors in 52 Weeks on the No Story Too Small blog.  I am extending this theme in 2015 to 104 Ancestors in 104 Weeks. Here is my ancestor biography for week #87:

Catharina (Ruth?) Konig (1770-1813)  is #103 on my Ahnentafel list, my 4th great-grandmother, who married #102 Philip Jacob King (1764-1829) in about 1789.

I am descended through:

* their daughter, 
#51 Elizabeth King (1796-1863), who married #50 Daniel Spangler (1781-1851), in 1815.
*  their daughter, #25 Rebecca Spangler (1832-1901) who married #24 David Jackson Carringer (1828-1902),  in 1852.
*  their son, #12 Henry Austin Carringer (1853-1946), who married #13 Abbie Ardell "Della" Smith (1862-1944) in 1887.
*  their son, #6 Lyle Lawrence Carringer (1891-1976), who married #7 Emily Kemp Auble (1899-1977) in 1918.
*  their daughter, #3 Betty Virginia Carringer (1919-2002), who married #2 Frederick Walton Seaver (1911-1983) in 1942.
*  their son, #1 Randall J. Seaver (1943-....)


1)  PERSON (with source citations as indicated in brackets):

*  Name:                    Catherine Ruth[1]   
*  Sex:                       Female   
2)  INDIVIDUAL FACTS (with source citations as indicated in brackets):
*  Birth:                    about 1770, Berks, Pennsylvania, United States[1]   
*  Death:                  8 December 1813 (about age 43), York, York, Pennsylvania, United States[2]
3)  SHARED FACTS (with source citations as indicated in brackets):
*  Spouse 1:             Philip Jacob Konig (1764-1829)   
*  Marriage 1:          before 1789 (before about age 19), probably York, Pennsylvania, United States[1]   

*  Child 1:                Anna Maria King (1790-    )    
*  Child 2:                Catherine King (1792-    )    
*  Child 3:                George King (1794-1860)    
*  Child 4:                Elizabeth King (1796-1863)    
*  Child 5:                Salome "Sarah" King (1797-1836)    
*  Child 6:                Lydia King (1799-    )    
*  Child 7:                Catherine King (1801-    )    
*  Child 8:                Jacob King (1803-    )    
*  Child 9:                Rebecca King (1805-    )    
*  Child 10:              Barbara King (1808-1852)    
*  Child 11:              Julia Anna King (1810-1825)    
*  Child 12:              Henry King (1813-    )  

4)  NOTES (with source citations as indicated in brackets):   

The name of Catharine (Ruth) Konig is found in the King Family of York, Pennsylvania book[1].  A birth or baptism date or a set of parents for Catharine Ruth are not known at this time.  However, some online family trees say she was born 10 March 1770 in Berks County, Pennsylvania to George and Anna Maria (Beuss) Ruth of Berks County, Pennsylvania.  

There is no known record of the marriage of Philip Jacob King and Catharine Ruth.  It may have occurred in York or Berks County, Pennsylvania.  They were probably married in about 1789, before the birth of their first child in January 1790.

Philip and Catharine had 12 children between 1790 and 1813[1].  They were:

*   Anna Maria King (1790-    ), married 1806 George Kann (1783-1877)    
*  Catherine King (1792-    ), died young.    
*  George King (1794-1860), married Rachel Johnston (1800-1874)   
*  Elizabeth King (1796-1863), married 1815 Daniel Spangler (1791-1851)  
*  Salome "Sarah" King (1797-1836), married 1821 Jacob Ehrhart ( 1794 - 1975)   
*  Lydia King (1799-    ), died young.
*  Catherine King (1801-    ), died young.    
* Jacob King (1803-1878 ), married Sarah Salome Smyser (1808-1895)   
*  Rebecca King (1805-    ), died young.    
*  Barbara King (1808-1852), who married 1829 Peter Zacharias (1800-    ).    
* Julia Anna King (1810-1825)    
* Henry King (1813-1886), married about 1838 Leah Johnston (1816-1844)

Note that the first female child is named Anna Maria, and the first male child is named George, which are the given names of the purported parents of Catharine Ruth.

Catharine (Ruth) King died on 8 December 1813 in York, York County, Pennsylvania, leaving Philip Jacob King with a household of young children[2].

No burial location is known, although she is probably buried in Prospect Hill Cemetery in York.

1. Richard Shue, The Kings of York County: Pioneers, Patriots and Papermakers (York, Penn. : the author, n.d.), Part III, page 5.

2. Richard Shue, The Kings of York County: Pioneers, Patriots and Papermakers , Part III, page 25.


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Thursday, August 27, 2015

How Can I Find What Paper or Microform Information is Kept in a Particular Area?

We had our monthly Chula Vista Genealogical Society program yesterday - it was a Problem Solving Panel answering questions submitted by CVGS members - see a summary at CVGS Program Review - Problem Solving Panel on 26 August 2015.

One of the questions submitted was this one: "When I have exhausted available online data, how can I find out what paper or microfiche information is kept in a particular area?"  It wasn't my question to answer, and Shirley did a good job responding in limited time, but my readers may be interested in what I would have said (given enough time):

1)  Published books, especially town, county and state histories, or compiled genealogies and family history books, can be found in local, public, private, county, university,  state, regional or national libraries, plus local or regional historical societies.  Almost every library has an online catalog, and so a searcher can access it online before visiting the repository.  City directories, business directories, telephone books and other directories may be available in these repositories.  A searcher can find out where a specific book is available by using online.

2)  Genealogy and family history periodicals can also be found in all of the libraries and historical societies noted above.  Most genealogy related periodicals have been collected at Allen County Public Library Genealogy Center in Fort Wayne, Indiana, and can be obtained from that library for a fee.  Use the PERiodical Source Index (PERSI) now on to search for pertinent articles.

3)  Unpublished manuscripts and/or paper collections, donated by individuals or organizations, can be found at libraries, state archives, national archives, genealogical societies, or historical societies. Many archived collection are indexed at NUCMC (National Union Catalog of Manuscript Collection - and ArchiveGRID (  

Some libraries, genealogical societies, and historical societies have unindexed paper collections in file cabinets or on shelves that can only be searched by going to the repository.  Local history and genealogy information can usually be found on the county pages at USGenWeb (  In addition, searchers can use the RootsWeb surname or locality message boards ( and mailing lists ( to determine where a local record might be found.  Searchers could request help from genealogical or historical societies, or professional researchers, to obtain these records.

4)  The Family History Library in Salt Lake City has an extensive collection of over 2.5 million microfilms and over 700,000 microfiche sets that have been imaged over the past 100 years or more.  They include user-contributed books and manuscripts, official court and land records, compiled vital record and cemetery books or manuscripts, etc.  You can access the FamilySearch Catalog at  If a collection has been digitized and is available online as a historical record collection, there will be a link to the digitized records.  Microfilms and microfiche setts can be ordered online to be sent to a local FamilySearch Center for a fee.

Note that there are many digitized microfilms available on the FamilySearch Historical Record Collections list ( are not every-name indexed, and therefore cannot be searched for.  Searchers can browse them at home - they are digital microfilm (see Dear Randy: What is the Most Important Skill for Finding Digital Records Online?).

Other large repositories (e.g., New England Historic Genealogical Society) may have a collection of microfilms for popular records in their locale.

5)  Vital Records (births, deaths, marriages) can be obtained at a local, county or state vital records office - see for record availability, access requirements, cost, and where to obtain records for each state.  Searchers can usually request records online, in person, or using a paid researcher.

6)  Official public records such as Court Records (e.g., civil, criminal, family, probate) and Land Records are filed in district or county courts in each state.  Searchers can request these records in person or using a paid researcher.  Check with the Family History Library Catalog first to see if there are microfilm or microfiche records for the record type and period of interest.

7)  The National Archives in Washington DC, and the branches around the country, has a tremendous number of federal records, including presidential, congressional, judicial, census, military, immigration, naturalization, and land.  Visit to see what can be found.  Many National Archives collections have been digitized or are being digitized already and are available online.

8)  State Archives have information pertaining to the public records, maps, books, papers, documents, etc. of the State's history, political history and geography.  See for locations and contact information.

9)  Local business and organization records (e.g., churches, cemeteries, funeral homes, schools, fraternal organizations) may be available in the business or organization offices, or in a local historical society or state archive.  Be sure to check websites,, and the FHL Catalog for these records first.

10)  Newspaper records may be available at local libraries and historical societies in paper format or on microfilm.  There may even be an index for articles available.  Or not.  It is very difficult to find articles or notices in a "cold search" of days and weeks of a newspaper that has not been digitized or indexed.  But sometimes that is the only way to find articles about your ancestral families.  Check Chronicling America ( to determine what newspapers were published in a locality, and check the online newspaper archives list at Wikipedia (

11)  Finally, let's recall the Iceberg chart that indicates that only about 10% of all genealogy records are available on the Internet - the rest are in archives, libraries, courthouses, etc.

Isn't it interesting that we can use online catalogs and websites to help us find genealogy and family history records that are not digitized.  The process of finding records offline has been simplified by having online finding aids to help us.

I'm sure that I've missed some resource types, or glossed over them, in the list above.  What other types of records, and where a searcher can access them, do my readers have to share?

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Review - "QuickSheet: Citing Genetic Sources for History Research, Evidence Style*"

The Genealogical Publishing Company in Baltimore has published another in its series of "QuickSheet" laminated research guides - this time for Citing Genetic Sources for History Research, Evidence Style*  by Elizabeth Shown Mills.

This QuickSheet booklet has four laminated pages on one 11" x 17" paper (folded). It is designed to give the user the basic guidelines for genealogy research in the allotted space, and provide an overview of the facts a researcher needs to know in order to begin and proceed successfully with research in the subject.

In this QuickSheet, Elizabeth Mills discusses crafting source citations for genetic and DNA test results for historical and genealogical research.

The QuickSheet: Citing Genetic Sources for History Research, Evidence Style* folder has these major subjects:

*  Who & Why

*  The Basics (of DNA tests)
*  Standards
*  Types of Genetic Reports
*  Basic Terms You Will Use
*  Basic Citation Formats
*  Basic Template for Online Database or Tool
*  Basic Template for an Offline Report
*  Models for Common Source Types
Allele Search ToolAncestry DNA CircleAutosomal DatabaseCertificateEthnicity PredictionGEDMatch ToolInstructional MaterialLetter ReportMT-DNA DatabaseSurname (or Ethnicity) ProjectX-Chromsome MatchY-Line Database
This booklet is designed primarily for the historian or genealogist who desires to craft a source citation for genetic and/or DNA information and test results.   One of the purposes of this QuickSheet is to show how to cite sources in compiling a genealogy using DNA analysis. As Ms. Mills demonstrates, the standards for citation, evidence analysis, and proof—when using DNA tests for historical purposes—are the same as those for sound historical and genealogical research. This QuickSheet demonstrates how to report test results, analyses, and instructional matter in ways that support those standards.

For someone like me that teaches and talks about genealogy a bit, the QuickSheet format is invaluable because I can pull it out and provide some guidance to my student or colleague interested in the subject.

The beauty of these "QuickSheet" folders is that they are very light and portable in a briefcase or laptop case. They are fixtures in my research case.

This four-page laminated booklet costs $9.95, plus postage and handling (4th Class Mail $4.50; FedEx Ground Service in the USA, $6.00). You can order it through the Genealogical  Store, or use the link for the 
QuickSheet: Citing Genetic Sources for History Research, Evidence Style* ) and click on the "Add to Cart" link. 

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Copyright (c) Randall J. Seaver, 2015.

Disclosure: contacted me recently and asked me to provide a review of this booklet. They mailed me a review copy for my personal use as remuneration for this review.

Treasure Chest Thursday - Post 277: 1808 Marriage Record of James Vaux and Mary Palmer in South Petherton, Somerset

It's Treasure Chest Thursday - time to look in my digital image files to see what treasures I can find for my family history and genealogy musings.

The treasure today is the  1808 marriage record of James Vaux and Mary Palmer of South Petherton, Somerset, England:

The specific marriage record is the third one down the page:

The information extracted from this record is (handwritten information in italics):

No.  30                       James Vaux of this Parish 
                                   and Mary Palmer 
                                  of the same Parish were
Married in this Church by Banns
this 13th Day of Dec'br in the Year One Thousand eight Hundred 
and eight                         By me    Thomas Rob???? Vicar
This marriage was solemnized by Us  {  James Vaux   Mary Palmer
In the Presence of {  Hannah Squire
                              {  Wm Harding

The source citation for this marriage record is:

Church of England, Parish Church of South Petherton (South Petherton, Somerset), South Petherton Parish Registers, Marriages, 1806-1812, Page 10 (penned), No. 30, Marriage of James Vaux and Mary Palmer, 8 October 1808; accessed on FHL microfilm BRITISH 1,526,363,Item 13.

James Vaux and Mary Palmer are my fourth great-grandparents.  They had ten children between 1810 and 1831, all in South Petherton, and emigrated in 1832 to Aurora, Erie County, New York.  I am descended through their son, Samuel Vaux (1816-1880) who married Mary Ann Underhill (1815-1883).  

Lookee there - signatures of James Vaux and Mary Palmer.  How cool is that?

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Wednesday, August 26, 2015

AncestryDNA Shared Matches Appear

AncestryDNA announced a new feature on the blog today - see See Your DNA Matches in a Whole New Way by Anna Swayne.

I read that and decided to see if I had any.  I went to my DNA Matches (sorted by Relationship) and saw my second cousin at the top of the list - she's been there for awhile now.  I clicked on her name and saw:

down at the bottom are three buttons - the one in the middle is new - it is "Shared Matches:"

 There were four "Shared Matches" on the list - I knew about and have corresponded with the first two of them, but the other two were new to me.

I clicked on the third one down on the list above, and saw the predicted relationship (4th cousin) and shared surnames and their tree:

The common surname that caught my eye was "Richmond" so I clicked on that and saw that the matching person's ancestor was Elizabeth A. Richmond (1854-1931):

I recognized Elizabeth A. Richmond as the sister of my great-grandfather, Thomas Richmond (1848-1917), so this looks like it's a probably DNA match.

The matching AncestryDNA person doesn't have any parents for Elizabeth A. Richmond, so if s/he checks my Ancestry Member Tree s/he will gather at least two more generations of Richmond and Rich ancestors.  If s/he adds them, s'he will be in the same four DNA Circles that I have in my DNA matches.

We share common ancestors James Richman and Hannah Rich, the parents of Elizabeth and Thomas Richmond, who came to America from England in the 1855 time from Wiltshire in England.  They are my second great-grandparents, so that makes the AncestryDNA person my third cousin.

I took a look at the AncestryDNA person's tree and was able to add some information, along with sources, to my own tree so that I can provide the AncestryDNA person with more information about his/her ancestry.

For the 4th match on the first screen above, one of the matching surnames was Hill from Wiltshire.  I also have that surname in Wiltshire so that is probably our DNA match, but it's a 6th or 7th cousin relationship.

This AncestryDNA feature appears to work well - I need to investigate more of my close matches and see what else I can find.

One of the lessons learned here is that not every AncestryDNA tester has a fully developed family tree.  Those that don't can be helped by those of us with a leafier tree, and perhaps some AncestryDNA tester will have a leafier tree than I do.

Now I need to contact this AncestryDNA tester and see if s/he knows anything about her Richmond family - perhaps there are family photos or papers that we can share.  I have pictures of James and Hannah (Rich) Richman, for instance.

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New York State Family History Conference is September 17-19, 2015

Do you have New York ancestry?  If so, you might want to attend the 2015 New York State Family History Conference from September 17 to 19, 2015 in Syracuse, New York at the Holiday Inn and Conference Center Syracuse/Liverpool.

The website for the Conference is

The description on the page says:

"The Central New York Genealogical Society and the New York Genealogical and Biographical Society are pleased to announce that our 2015 New York State Family History Conference has been chosen by the Federation of Genealogical Societies as one of their regional conferences. The Second New York State Family History Conference is increasing in size and duration and will feature three simultaneous lecture tracks and more exhibitors. The Federation of Genealogical Societies is sponsoring the first day of the conference. At present, other conference sponsors include the Capital District Genealogical Society, FamilySearch,, the New England Historic Genealogical Society, the New York State Library and Archives and the William G. Pomeroy Foundation.

The 2015 NYSFHC Conference will be three days long and consist of three concurrent tracts, and will run from Thursday, September 17, 2015 through Saturday, September 19, 2015. We will also be scheduling a pre-conference research day. Thursday's programming will be organized and hosted by the Federation of Genealogical Societies. The Conference will be held at the Syracuse/Liverpool Holiday Inn, located at 441 Electronics Parkway, in Liverpool, N.Y."

The Program summary is provided at  There is a link to the agenda ( which can be downloaded and saved):

There are many excellent speakers scheduled for this conference - notable are Judy G. Russell, Thomas W. Jones, David e. Rencher, Curt Witcher, D. Joshua Taylor, Dick Eastman, James Folts, Henry Hoff and many others.

To register online at the NYG&B website, click here.

To print a registration form to register by mail click here.

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Copyright (c) 2015, Randall J. Seaver

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More Genealogy Friends at 2008 SCGS Jamboree -- Post 375 of (Not So) Wordless Wednesday

I'm posting old (and sometimes new) family photographs from my collection on Wednesdays, but they won't be wordless posts like others do - I am incapable of having a wordless post.

Here are some of the most precious (to me) images from my Seaver/Carringer genealogy collection - these are from the Southern California Genealogical Society in Burbank held in June 2008:

1)  Megan Smolenyak and Marcy Brown of Roots Television with moi:

2)  Jane Lindsey, Kathryn Doyle and ???? (help!) of the California Genealogical Society and Library looking through the Syllabus:

3)  The always well-dressed, dapper and smiling Leland Meitzler in front of his Everton Publishers display:

This was my first Jamboree, but I had been blogging for two years, so I knew the names, and some of the faces, of the exhibitors.  It was great fun to meet these folks in person and get to know them and discuss their products.

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Tuesday, August 25, 2015

Down the Rabbit Hole - Finding the Estate Papers of John Underhill (1721-1793) of Chester, N.H.

After I responded to an Ancestry message about the Underhill family today, I realized that I had not found probate records for my Underhill families in New Hampshire.  Surely, there must be some!

I struck out trying to find probate records for John Underhill (1745-1816) in Grafton or Sullivan Counties, where he resided and was buried, respectively, so I went next to John Underhill (1721-1793) of Chester in Rockingham County, New Hampshire.  I grabbed the bright shiny records here!

Here is the research process I used, in hopes that it will help other researchers work in these "Browse images" records on FamilySearch.

1)  On the "FamilySearch Historical Record Collections" page (, I put "new hamp" in the Filter field and thel ist of New Hampshire records was presented:

There are two Probate record collections, one for County Probate Estate Files (i.e., the complete probate estate file) and the County Probate Records (i.e., the probate court clerk volumes).  I'm going to search for the Estate Files first because those may be more complete.

2)  Here is the record collection page for the "New Hampshire County Probate Estate Files, 1769-1936."

There are 877,366 images in this collection.  I always get a laugh in my presentations when I say "that should take a day or two to look through."

3)  Of course, the records are "Waypointed" into Counties.  I clicked on the "Browse through 877,366 images" link and saw the list of counties with records in this collection:

Whew - Rockingham County is one of the four counties listed.

4)  I clicked on "Rockingham" and saw the list of "volumes" available for the County:

There is a set of estate Case Indexes, so I'm going to click on the one that might contain Underhill - the "Case Index Stevens, P. - Young, W., 1771-1869.

5)  There were 2,450 images in this volume, but they were very nicely alphabetized, so I easily found John Underhill who died in 1793 in Chester on image 1062.

The key information on the card image above is the Case number - #5922.

6)  Now I can go back to the list of Rockingham County volumes, and select the "Case No. 5921-6015, 1793-4" volume.  

Since Case 5922 is the second case in the volume, I easily found the start of the John Underhill case file on image 22 of 1041:

There were only 6 images in this case file, including the handwritten will with John Underhill's signature.  Here is image 26 of 1041 with the start of the will:

The source citation provided by FamilySearch for the will page above is:

"New Hampshire, County Probate Estate Files, 1769-1936," images,  FamilySearch   (,383166901 : accessed 25 August 2015), Rockingham > Case no 5921-6015 1793-1794 > image 26 of 1041; county courthouses, offices of register of probate, and historical societies, New Hampshire.

7)  I downloaded all of the papers in this Case File #5922, and renamed them as:


and changing the image number as required.

I saved these six images in my file folder for:

/My Documents/Genealogy/Ancestor Files/> Family History > Carringer-Smith-Auble-Kemp > Underhill > John Underhill + Joanna Healey > Documents 

8)  Now I can transcribe the probate papers to squeeze as much information as I can about this record for my sixth great-grandfather.  My hope is that it mentions the children of my fifth-great-grandfather, John Underhill (1745-1816), but I don't hold much hope for that!  And I will put the transcription in my Amanuensis Monday series in the future.

9)  I'm glad I went after this bright shiny probate record and spent an hour going down this rabbit hole.

As I've pointed out before, if I had done this five years ago, I would have had to go to the Family History Library in Salt Lake City to do it (costing money and spending an hour of time), or, alternatively, ordered at least three microfilms at the local FamilySearch Library (costing some money and spending two to three months to find the record.

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