Tuesday, August 16, 2011

Need Help with German (?) Location

I know how smart and experienced my Genea-Musings readers are, so I'm quite sure that someone can figure out what this record says:

This is from the Ancestry.com collection of:

"St. Louis, Missouri Marriage Records, 1804-1876," online database, Ancestry.com (http://www.ancestry.com), St. Louis Records, 1860, page 516 (penned), image 218; citing original data from: St. Louis Genealogical Society. St. Louis Marriage Index, 1804-76. St. Louis, MO, USA: St. Louis Genealogical Society, 1999.

My transcription of this entry is:

State of Missouri)  Joined by F.A.H. Schneider Justice (?) in the Bonds of Matrimony 
County of St. Louis) this first day of May 1858 Mr. Ignatz Griser of the City of St. Louis
Missouri late of ????? Grand Duchy of ????? and Miss Catherine Gute of the same place
late of Rhenish Bavaria  Certified J.A.H. Schneider Justice of the Peace
Filed & Recorded May 10 1862  A.C. Bemondy Recorder

I cannot read the two places mentioned for Ignatz Griser - are they Brihl, Brile, Buhl, Bule, Baihl, Baile, or some other combination.  The two look like "Brihl" and "Baile" to me. 

I know very little about the historical German states, and a Google search and Wikipedia search turned up no likely candidates.

This couple are two of my wife's great-great-grandparents.

What say you, smart Genea-Musings reader? 

I found an interesting anomaly while searching for this record.  I found it be searching in Ancestry Member Trees for Ignatius Grieser, and came upon this source in a member tree:

The database that this was obtained from is the "Missouri Marriages, 1805-2002" collection.  I clicked on the link on that page to show the image, and the page with the record appeared.  When I look in the Ancestry.com Card Catalog and search for "Missouri Marriages" this database does not appear, as shown below:

What happened?  Did the previous database get broken up into several other databases, by county?  If so, the links to the specific page must have been changed. 


Tamura Jones said...

Bühl in the Grand Duchy of Baden.

Donna Hansen Peterson said...

Buhl is a town/village in Bavaria. I looked at the message boards for Bavaria and did a search for Buhl. According to Mapcarta:
Buhl Map Mapcarta Europe
Central Europe Germany Bavaria
Buhl is in Bavaria, Southern Germany. Buhl's location is 50° 5' (50.083333°) north latitude, 10° 40' (10.666667°) east longitude, and Buhl has an average elevation of 396 meters above sea level. Explore Mapcarta's engaging full-screen Buhl map, or the smaller map of Buhl below.

Frances Elizabeth Schwab said...
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David said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
David said...

What Tamura said; it's Bühl. Baden (the record shows "Bade") was a Grand Duchy; Bavaria was not. Also note that Bühl isn't far from "Rhenish Bavaria," aka Rheinland-Pfalz.

As for the source, Missouri Marriages, 1805-2002 is apparently a database comprised of many different sources that Ancestry has collected. To find the original details for a St. Louis marriage, use St. Louis, Missouri Marriages, 1804-76, which is an index originally created by the St. Louis Genealogical Society based on the now non-public marriage indexes at City Hall. The marriage was recorded in volume 10 on page 516.

Randy Seaver said...

Thank you all for the help.

Geneablogger Nick Gombash on Facebook found Ignatius Griesser's birth record at http://www.landesarchiv-bw.de/plink/?f=5-497525 and led me to the image. Taco Goulooze gave me the link on google Plus - https://www2.landesarchiv-bw.de/ofs21/bild_zoom/zoom.php?bestand=10028&id=2242707&gewaehlteSeite=05_0000497525_0128_5-497525-128.png&ausgangspunkt=thumbnails&groesseThumbnails=150&thumbnailsProSeite=50&screenbreite=1440&screenhoehe=870

I looked at the image and think it's the 4th one down the page. But I can't read the script for the date and the parents.

There are lots of Griessers in this town record!

Randy Seaver said...

That Ignatius and Catherine were from different places in the marriage record may indicate that they met in America and not in Germany. Which means there may be a Gute/Guddy family in St. Louis that she belongs to.

Craig Manson said...

It is Buhl (mit umlaut). It is not in Bavaria, but in Baden-Wuettemberg,which is due west of Bavaria. I lived not too far away in Karlsruhe as a child.

Craig Manson said...

I misspelled "Wuerttemberg"!

Gary said...

It is definitely Bühl in Baden. The recordkeeper was unsure of the umlaut.